Race Fuel

[MA$TER_E]

So I know we have some race junkies on here

*cough cough Baystr cough*

I've been wanting to run some high end fuel in the ZX but am not sure what to get. The ZX is totaly stock and has a CR of 13.3:1 witch I've been told is pretty high but I dont know... I know I want to stay away from lead but what is the difference between oxygenated and non-oxygenated? These were the two types of fuel I was looking at. What do the guys that know what they are talking about think???


Street Blaze 100 (My guess; this is CRAP)

Oxygenated with ethanol, this CARB-legal fuel is specifically engineered for high-performance street cars including sport compacts, muscle cars, street rods and more. It's environmentally friendly and street legal throughout the U.S. In applications with anything from 4- to 12-cyclinders or engines equipped with a turbocharger, supercharger or nitrous oxide system (NOS), StreetBlaze 100 will generate optimum power and performance. In turbocharged or supercharged applications, it allows an increase in boost without fear of detonation. NOS users can also leverage their higher octane ratings to step up to a more powerful nitrous oxide system. Dyno tests with a turbocharged application proved StreetBlaze100 generates up to 14% more horsepower compared to premium grade 91 octane unleaded gasoline. Designed for use in cast-iron head engines with CRs up to 13:1 and aluminum head engines up to 14:1. Works well on the latest generation of electronically-controlled turbo engines. Contains no metal compounds and won't harm catalytic converters or oxygen sensors.

Color: Orange
Oxygenated: Yes
Motor Octane 96
R+M/2: 100
Specific Gravity: .746 at 60° F
http://www.vpracingfuels.com/images/1.jpghttp://www.vpracingfuels.com/images/2.jpghttp://www.vpracingfuels.com/images/3.jpghttp://www.vpracingfuels.com/images/4.jpghttp://www.vpracingfuels.com/images/5.jpghttp://www.vpracingfuels.com/images/6.jpghttp://www.vpracingfuels.com/images/7.jpghttp://www.vpracingfuels.com/images/8.jpghttp://www.vpracingfuels.com/images/6.jpghttp://www.vpracingfuels.com/images/7.jpghttp://www.vpracingfuels.com/images/8.jpg




C10 (My guess; the good stuff)

The best non-oxygenated unleaded racing gasoline available. C10 does not contain any metal compounds and will not harm catalytic converters or oxygen sensors. Used by national champions in SCCA and IMSA stock classes.

Color: Clear
Motor Octane 96
Research Octane: 104
R+M/2: 100
http://www.vpracingfuels.com/images/1.jpghttp://www.vpracingfuels.com/images/2.jpghttp://www.vpracingfuels.com/images/3.jpghttp://www.vpracingfuels.com/images/4.jpghttp://www.vpracingfuels.com/images/5.jpghttp://www.vpracingfuels.com/images/6.jpghttp://www.vpracingfuels.com/images/7.jpghttp://www.vpracingfuels.com/images/8.jpghttp://www.vpracingfuels.com/images/6.jpghttp://www.vpracingfuels.com/images/7.jpghttp://www.vpracingfuels.com/images/8.jpg

[MA$TER_E]

Ok, so I know what Oxygenated Fuels are now...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oxygenate

So Non-Oxygenated is more gooder... Right? :unsure:

[Baystr]

i just do what i am told, used to run sunoco gt 240 now run vp U4, i don't know anything else, except, your bike should be tuned for it if you are gonna spend the money.............and if you tune for it, and take a long road trip, ie maupin or whatever, you have to carry octane boost, so your fucked either way, don't tune for it, and then just run it for track days..........that would work.......you would enjoy it, and is smells sweet, gives me the jollies just to sniff it. sometimes i spend hours in my little race trailer, all closed up, just sniffing my race fuel

[Flyte Risk]

My dear boy... why... WHY don't you just call me for the answer to your question?

Your bike is TUNED for pump gas, if you run race fuel I highly doubt that you will gain any power. In fact I'd bet you'd lose a little.

I could totally turn this into a post about static compression ratio, dynamic compression, camshaft duration and valve overlap, octane and fuel burn rates but i won't.

[MA$TER_E]

My dear boy... why... WHY don't you just call me for the answer to your question?

Your bike is TUNED for pump gas, if you run race fuel I highly doubt that you will gain any power. In fact I'd bet you'd lose a little.

I could totally turn this into a post about static compression ratio, dynamic compression, camshaft duration and valve overlap, octane and fuel burn rates but i won't.

No please do... I got ahold of some super unleaded with no ethanol and felt a very noticable gain in power...

[Flyte Risk]

Yeah, your bike is tuned for that non-oxy gas. Keep using it, anything more and you're wasting your money

BTW, race gas is $8/gal

[MA$TER_E]

I wouldn't want to run pure race fuel all the time. Just once in a while top my tank off before heading out on a ride. I know my bikes not setup for it but what is there to setup other than the Air Fuel mixture? I've got a 13.3:1 compression ration which is in the range they recommend for the fuel. So I just don't understand why you wouldn't want to run it???

:thinking:

[Flyte Risk]

I am so not going to type out a whole page on valve timing, dynamic compression and dynamic stroke length.

The short answer is that yes, you have 13.3:1 static compression. HOWEVER your cylinder pressure isn't enough to utilize the higher octane and your ignition map isn't curved for it either EFFECTIVLY You are probably only about 8.3 DYNAMIC CR

If you want the long story on it call me tonight and pick my brain, there is more in there then just boogers, cobwebs and random bits of porn.

[Nicegy525]

I would follow Flyte's advice on this one. if you wanna try it just to mess around then go for it.

If youre thinkin long term use forget it. Its really only useful at the track and for racers who really need that extra couple HP.

Youre not gonna get much HP gains if your bike is not mapped correctly for it. if you spend the money and have it dynotuned you could gain 5-6 hp out of race fuel.

[Flyte Risk]

http://www.eugenesportbike.com/forum/showpost.php?p=32303&postcount=20

That should screw your mind up for a few days.

[MA$TER_E]

Yea, I'm not trying to build power I could give a damn really. What made me start to think about it more was the tank of of premium unleaded non-ethanol I got. There was a significant difference in the way the bike behaved. I don't want to say it had more power it just delivered the same power quicker. If that makes sense at all...

The bike just seamed to run smoother and snappier than it ever has.

I'm not looking at stocking up in super high-end exotic race fuel so I have a fire breathing mad HP producing machine... I just want something a bit better than the premium we get at the pump thats safe to run in my bike once in a while and is reasonably priced. If its $45 for 5 gallons thats not to bad in my opinion...

The other alternative to race fuel I'm not to wild about is an additive... I know they are out there but not sure I want to go down that road...

[Flyte Risk]

Why not run more non-oxy fuel? I know of a dozen places to get in in the metro area.

[JonXX]

What Flyte Said

and

For a budget alternative, you can run out to the airport and run 100 low-lead. It's not completely unleaded (but not leaded enough to leave deposits) and is 100 octane, non-oxygenated, non-ethanol gasoline. You don't *have* to tune for it but it's better if you do. Keep in mind that it's formulated for use in high compression and forced induction engines in lower O2 environments (think a few thousand feet up).

That being said, I don't even run super in any of my bikes, I run regular or mid-grade. A higher octane rating means a net loss of BTUs per unit of fuel (less energy). I get ~230 miles on 5 gallons of regular, ~200 on a tank of super. That's a pretty huge difference.

High octane fuel is used in very high compression engines because the higher flash point (due to less readily available energy) means reduced compression detonation (but you already knew that).

[Flyte Risk]

The correction to your statement Jon is that aviation fuel is designed for low compression engines that *may* be supercharged but they all turn low rpm's. Av-gas really has one of the shittiest burn rates of all the fuels out there.

Then again, thats what my boat engine is being built to run on since it's only ~$3.50/gallon. In an engine I couldn't adjust the timing on I wouldn't run it unless I had to.

[JonXX]

The correction to your statement Jon is that aviation fuel is designed for low compression engines that *may* be supercharged but they all turn low rpm's.

True. My TIO-360 (200 hp) is about 7.5:1 and is rated at something like 2575 rpm.

My Robinson though, nearly has the compression of a diesel engine and turns nearly 10k....Same fuel.

But neither of those are BIKES! lol

[MA$TER_E]

So long story short... I'm fucked...

I'll just through two bottles of this in my tank and call it good...

http://i299.photobucket.com/albums/mm287/land6266/00000000%20-%20OSB%20Storage/large36-380.jpg

[Jane Honda]

:hysterical:

[Nicegy525]

that stuff only works in GSXR'S!!! :lol:

[JonXX]

that stuff only works in GSXR'S!!! :lol:

beat me to it!

[Flyte Risk]

True. My TIO-360 (200 hp) is about 7.5:1 and is rated at something like 2575 rpm.

8.5:1 CR, 180 hp and 2700 rpm but who's keeping track of that anyway.

[Redlegracing]

There is anouther answer... yes, having a bike mapped for race gas makes the difference. In the old days that ment trips to a shop with a dyno and $$$ in mapping fees... I used to be a power commander fan but I think Bazzaz is on to something with thier new systems... AUTO-MAP feature, it costs more up front but once installed it would eliminate the need for a trip to the dyno...

http://www.bazzazperformance.com/index.php?page=shop.browse&category_id=3&option=com_virtuemart&Itemid=26

" The optional Z-AFM kit consists of an air fuel sensor and amplifier box that plugs into the any of the Z-Fi products, and allows for self-mapping of the motorcycle. Self-mapping means that as the user rides the bike, on the track or on a dynamometer, the Z-Fi automatically calculates the required fuel adjustment at each RPM and Throttle Position to reach the user selectable target air fuel ratio.

The Z-Fi Mapper software allows for the user to easily enter the target air fuel ratio, start, stop, and review the results of the self-mapping function. Once the recommended adjustments have been reviewed, the user can either apply all of the suggested adjustments or just a certain range with a few simple clicks of the mouse."

This is the next mod I am going to put on my bike...:thumbup:

SDS is a great local shop to install it....

[Flyte Risk]

SDS *was* a good shop... I guess you didn't get the memo.

[YAMR6]

Hey Mike,

Your full of gas!

That is all...

[Jane Honda]

Hey Mike,

Your full of gas!

That is all...


Hot air, gas, same thing... :haha:

[YAMR6]

When your right, your right!

[Flyte Risk]

And I shall eat a diet rich in taco Bell and share said gas with all of you.

[Ms. Flyte Risque]

OMFG, believe me, it's like something died in him....

And I shall eat a diet rich in taco Bell and share said gas with all of you.

[Jane Honda]

I would have put one of your toys to good use if it were me... :vomit:



I would hot glue the bastard to his ass!

[MA$TER_E]

:hysterical: Now thats funny

[DrDuc]

Why not run more non-oxy fuel? I know of a dozen places to get in in the metro area.

Would you be willing to post the names/location of the sources of non-oxy fuel? I'm in the dark as to where to find it.

[Flyte Risk]

http://www.boatoregon.com/OSMB/news/docs/EthanolList.pdf

[MA$TER_E]

:haha: I just PM'd him :yes:

[Xflyer]

I would have put one of your toys to good use if it were me... :vomit:



I would hot glue the bastard to his ass!


:spitwater:
:hysterical::hysterical::hysterical::hysterical::h ysterical:

OMFG.. THAT IS FUNNY!!!! I just about choked to death on my jello!